Daniel 8.13-Daniel Hears An Angel Asking Another Angel How Long It Will Take For the Vision to be Fulfilled
Wenstrom Bible Ministries
Pastor-Teacher Bill Wenstrom
Tuesday August 13, 2013
Daniel: Daniel 8:13-Daniel Hears An Angel Asking Another Angel How Long It Will Take For the Vision to be Fulfilled
Lesson # 241
Please turn in your Bibles to Daniel 8:1.
Daniel 8:1 During the third year of Belshazzar’s reign, the king, a vision appeared to me, I, Daniel after the one appearing to me previously. 2 Indeed, I was staring because of this vision. Specifically, I myself was in a trance like state staring as I myself was in Susa, the citadel, which was in the province of Elam. Furthermore, I was staring because of this vision as I myself was beside the Ulai Canal. 3 Then, I lifted up my eyes and then I was staring as behold a ram was standing in front of the canal with it possessing two horns. Furthermore, the two horns were long. However, one was longer than the other with the longer one growing up last. 4 I saw this ram continually butting westward as well as northward and in addition southward as all the beasts could by no means stand in front of it. Furthermore, none could deliver out from its power so that it acted according to its desire. Indeed, it became great. 5 Then, I myself was in a trance like state as behold a male-goat who is ruler over the goats, was traveling from the west over the earth’s surface. In fact, it was not touching the earth’s surface. Also, this male-goat had a conspicuous horn between its eyes. 6 Next, it traveled up to the ram possessing two horns which I saw standing in front of the canal. In fact, it charged against it in a powerful rage. 7 Consequently, I saw it wage an attack opposing this ram while causing itself to become enraged against it. Indeed, it repeatedly struck this ram so as to shatter its two horns. Also, there was no ability in the ram to stand in front of it. Then, it drove it to the ground as well as trampled on it repeatedly. Indeed, to the detriment of the ram, there was none who could deliver from its power. 8 So the male-goat who is the ruler over the goats was very great. However, as soon as it became powerful, the unusual horn was broken. Then, in its place, four conspicuous ones arose towards the heaven’s four winds. 9 Next, from one of them, a small horn in comparison emerged which grew excessively large toward the south as well as the east and in addition the beautiful land. 10 Specifically, it grew larger than the heaven’s host. Indeed, it caused some of this host, yes some of these stars to fall to the earth. Also, it trampled on them. 11 It even presented itself as great as the host’s Commander while taking away the daily sacrifice from Him so that His holy place was abandoned. 12 Consequently the host along with the daily sacrifice were delivered over to it through transgression. Also, it caused the truth to be thrown to the ground. Indeed, it executed, yes it succeeded. (My translation)
Daniel 8:13 Then I heard a holy one speaking, and another holy one said to that particular one who was speaking, “How long will the vision about the regular sacrifice apply, while the transgression causes horror, so as to allow both the holy place and the host to be trampled?” (NASB95)
“Then I heard a holy one speaking, and another holy one said to that particular one who was speaking” refers to a conversation between two elect angels with the second one mentioned posing a question to the first one mentioned.
“The vision” is the noun ḥā·zôn (חָזוֹן) (khaw-zone´), which refers to the revelation Daniel received from God, which is recorded in Daniel 8:2-12 in which extrasensory audiovisual experiences, which were revelatory in character, were perceived by him.
“The regular sacrifice” is the noun tā·mîḏ (תָּמִיד) (taw-meed´), which means “daily sacrifice” referring to the continual burnt offering presented in the Jewish temple in the morning and in the evening.
“While the transgression causes horror” is epexegetical meaning that it defines specifically for the reader the previous question regarding the length of time it would be to fulfill the vision concerning the daily sacrifice.
“The transgression causes horror” is composed of the noun pě·šǎʿ (פֶּשַׁע) (peh´-shah), “the transgression” and then we have the verb šā·mēm (שָׁמֵם) (shaw-mame´), “causes horror.”
The noun pě·šǎʿ means “transgression” referring to the actions of the small horn, which are described in verses 10-12.
The actions of the small horn involved killing some of the host and taking away the daily sacrifice so that the holy place was abandoned.
These actions represent the sinful actions of Antiochus Epiphanes which he committed against the faithful Jews in Israel and God when he forbid these faithful Jews to worship God through offering the daily sacrifice in the temple in Jerusalem.
It speaks of these sinful actions from the perspective that they constitute rebellion against God.
The verb šā·mēm means “to make desolate” referring to something being destroyed in a ruined state, implying the object or area destroyed is now abandoned or deserted referring to the sinful actions of the small horn making desolate the holy place since these actions defiled and made it ceremonially unclean.
“To allow” is the verb nā∙ṯǎn (נָתַן) (naw-than), which means “to deliver over” referring to the holy place and the host being delivered over to the power of the small horn.
“The holy place” is the noun qō·ḏěš (קֹדֶשׁ) (ko´-desh), which means “sanctuary, holy place” referring to the temple standing in Jerusalem in the second century B.C. which was dedicated to the worship of the God of Israel.
This noun describes this temple as set apart and dedicated exclusively for the worship of the God of Israel.
“The host” is the noun ṣā·ḇā(ʾ) (צָבָא) (tsaw-baw´), which is referring specifically the faithful believers in Israel since Gabriel in Daniel 8:24 interprets this word as referring to the “mighty men” of Israel, which is a reference to the nation of Israel.
Daniel 8:13 Then I heard a holy one speaking and a holy one said to this particular one who was speaking, “How long is the vision, the daily sacrifice, specifically the transgression making desolate resulting in delivering over both the sanctuary as well as the host to be trampled?” (Author’s translation)
After the vision has been completed, Daniel informs the reader that in this vision he heard two elect angels of God having a conversation with one asking another how long it would take for the vision to be fulfilled.
Specifically, one angel was asking another how long the host and the holy place would be delivered over to the power of the small horn of the male goat.
There are several indications that this is a conversation between two angels and not two human beings.
First of all, in Daniel 8:15, God orders the elect arch angel Gabriel to interpret the vision for Daniel which would indicate that he was the one who answered another angel’s question regarding how long it would take for the vision to be fulfilled.
The angel asking the question was a lower rank than Gabriel who we know is an arch angel or ruling angel.
1 Peter 1:12 teaches that angels long to look into revelation given by God to men such as Daniel, which appears to be the case for the angel asking the question of Gabriel.
The angel subordinate to Gabriel asks the same question Daniel would have asked.
The reference to the daily sacrifice in Daniel 8:13 refers to the Levitical offerings which were presented to Yahweh as means of worshipping Him in the temple in Jerusalem which stood in the second century B.C.
The transgression making desolate resulting in delivering over both the sanctuary and the host to be trampled refers to the actions of the small horn which are described by Daniel in verses 10-12.
These verses present a symbolic description and prophecy of Antiochus Epiphanes IV waging war against Israel and killing some of the faithful remnant in Israel.
The description of the small horn trampling on the stars refers to the Antiochus Epiphanes IV attempting to wipe out this faithful remnant in Israel.
Verses 10-12 also describe in symbolic prophetic terms Antiochus Epiphanes opposing God by abolishing the daily sacrifice in the Jewish Temple which were offered up to the God of Israel as an act of worship.
So in Daniel 8:11-12, we see that God is employing two elect angels to communicate to Daniel how long it will take for this vision to be fulfilled.
In the twenty first century there is a lot of misinformation regarding the nature of angels and their activities.
This is to be expected since we do live in the devil’s world.
He has been from the beginning and continues to deceive the entire world regarding his existence, and the nature of himself and his objectives for becoming like the Most High.
The only place where we can find the truth about the angels and concerning Satan himself is the infallible Word of God.
The Bible teaches that angels are temporarily superior to mankind (Heb. 2).
In terms of power and ability, the present angelic superiority to mankind is obvious in every passage of scripture in which they are described.
This current angelic superiority significantly also extends to the area of longevity.
While mankind is enjoying a sequential residence on earth (generation following generation), angelic kind has been experiencing a continuum of existence in heaven, even before the creation of Man.
This longevity, combined with the fact that angels (though creatures like Man) are not subject to the same degree to the restraints and necessities of time and space that encumber mankind, undoubtedly contributes to their superior knowledge and wisdom as well.
By its very essence, therefore, the angelic nature is superior to our present earthly human nature in terms of appearance, intellect, power, mobility and authority (2 Pet.2:11).
Angels will ultimately be inferior to mankind and will not always be superior to mankind.
Just as our Lord’s humanity is, in resurrection, superior to angels in every way (Heb.1:4-2:18), so also we are destined to share that superiority with Him in our resurrection (1 Cor.6:3; Heb.2:5).
Angels are acutely aware of and involved in human affairs.
The involvement of angelic beings in human affairs is part and parcel of their role in promoting (or, in the case of the fallen angels, opposing) God's plan for human history.
On a more personal level, however, angels are also apparently extremely interested in observing human behavior in general and in the playing out of God's plan in particular (1Tim.3:16; 5:21; 1Pet.1:10-12).
The observation of human behavior is particularly true in the case of the Son of Man, our Lord Jesus Christ.
They were present at His birth (Lk.2:13-14), temptation (Matt.4:11), resurrection (Lk.24:4), ascension (Acts 1:10-11), and return (2 Thes.1:7), evidence which underscores angelic interest in the most crucial phase of God's plan, namely the life and work of the Messiah.
By observation, angels are learning (to their joy in the case of the elect angels, to their sorrow in the case of the fallen angels) about the wisdom, the power, the grace and the mercy of God (cf. Lk.15:10; 1Cor.4:9; 11:10).
Man cannot see angels for they are invisible but can be seen by man when God does one of two things: (1) He lifts the veil of the spiritual dimension (2 Kings 6:17). (2) He allows them to change their form to human (Hebrews 13:2).
Jesus Christ as the Lord of the armies is the commander of the angels.
Michael is the prince of Israel according to Daniel 10:21, 12:1 and he defends the Jews in the tribulation from the wrath of Satan (Revelation 12:7).
He fought with Satan over the body of Moses (Jude 9; 2 Peter 2:11).
Gabriel is also an army commander who also functions as one of the kings of arms in the college of heralds.
In Daniel 8:16 and 9:21, he was sent to explain Daniel’s vision and he announced the birth of John the Baptist (Luke 1:11), and the birth of Jesus Christ (Luke 1:19, 26).
Angels do not die and their number does not increase or decrease (Luke 20:36).
There are different ranks of angels (Ephesians 6:12; Colossians 1:16).
The angels were created in a hierarchy because they are called “archangels” (1 Thessalonians 4:16).
