Messianic Expectation

Thank you, James, for the introduction. Thank you to Doug, and Rob, for the groundwork that you've already laid today.

And I also want to thank Rob again for this research topic. When we first decided we were going to do this kind of similar to lectures. I have been here in the past where there's one speaker. We decided that we would be three men doing the work of One Robs throughout the idea of Messianic expectation, and it was really marvelous. It was really a fun time of reading and research over the last month and a half, trying to understand the history behind these ideas. It was really fascinating to me. And if you've ever talked before, you know, that the role of the teacher was really exciting for a teacher, is attempting to prove. Is that what you yourself have learned? Whether you learn anything, you'll learn different things than I learned when everytime materials presented, but for me, I just hope that I can convey the interesting components of what I learned and speakers before, and I'll see if I can land This Plane without crashing. Messianic expectation in the Torah prophets and Psalms

I really believe that this is a complex task. and, Especially the things I'm talking about are not just the biblical texts. But also how mess and expectation was viewed in the larger Jewish and Christian contacts.

Really any question of Messianic expectation? Is a question of.

In what Manner? Will Redemption come? How will we be redeemed? It involves how it involves Quinn. It involves who? Any discussion of this really the umbrella that were thinking about his Redemption, how do we get redeemed? What is our Redemption? Look like the Redemption of individuals and also the Redemption of the world, because this is a universal. Issue, how will the world be redeemed and naturally? There are varying? Perspectives on this. And I think sometimes, as followers of Yeshua, it's hard for us. It's already been mentioned twice today. It's hard for us to put ourselves in someone else's shoes to truly listen to our fellow, especially regarding this topic because truthfully, most of us have come to your shua and he was the Messiah for us. He was the Messiah. There was no doubt. He was the Messiah for us at that moment. So we almost view messiah in our lives as a Birthright. We came, we came to God recognizing your shoes, She at work. Jesus Christ. That's just a part of who we are from the very beginning. Until we read passages like he explained to them on the road to Emmaus Moshe and all the prophets and he interpreted them in all the scriptures, the things concerning himself. And we think, hey, it's so obvious. It's so obvious everyone. It's so obvious friendly Jewish friend. It's so obvious, non-religious person. It's so obvious. I'll insert my very favorite Messianic passage and just not understand why you don't get it. Insert Psalm, 22 insert Isaiah 53, insert Zechariah 9, insert, Malachi 3, insert, Michael 5 on Tuesday. It's so obvious. It must be your spiritual darkness. That it prevents you from seeing any of these truth, spiritually blind person. And it creates an arrogance in US. We don't consider our fellows position. How they have interpreted. Some of these things. How they have viewed. Messianic expectation.

Not only do. I think it creates an arrogance in us. I think sometimes it creates an apathy.

We know all about Messiah. We know all about Christ. It's his last name, right? It's right there in his name. We know all about that, but I was actually about two months ago and someone use the term of Jesus Christ and a less Church person asked, does Christ mean and that the speaker said, well, you know, it means god. No, it doesn't it doesn't this was just a typical. I mean what she wasn't is and what I'm trying to say is because we deal with the term and the idea so much almost like a Birthright between apathetically. I don't even think we understand our own or the other very well.

In the sentence, the church stake out some ground on the Messianic beachhead. We staked out. Ground pretty early on in our face right at the beginning. Our space. I believe, with all my heart was birthed from the ancient Judaism.

And because of that. The Messianic idea inside of Judaism did not flourish in a estate organic way. Very often in the Jewish world.

Starting to thousand years ago. They were defending against the claims of the followers of Jesus. Nesting isn't in the Jewish World. Grew largely as an apologetic.

They had ideas, of course. But as it has progressed, it became very apologetic. Did they wrote in defense of what the ground at the followers of Jesus had staked out?

And in fact, this is this idea of a messianism or Messing expectation. In the Jewish world has been quite neglected. It is a field of study that really has shrunk over the years. Because it was kind of like the ground of the Christian. And I would say, one of the reason to trunk and you can understand this, a, I think it can be encapsulated in this race once burned, Twice Shy. Write Rob had that slides that I pulled out of him at the end with some of the Messianic claimants. Mini up to your shoes time, maybe 10 to mention and ask. We all know about the bar close to the rebellion in 130, ad, which was a very significant event in the history of the Jewish world and even say with rabbis through cells behind Shimon, bar kochba, but he was crushed by ROM Becomes of this. Messianic idea, once burnt it takes the retreat.

Also, I would say hi to me and more Wilson spoke from this very place. I don't know. Last time he was here. I thought to myself, I never heard of that.

who was a Jewish, he wasn't a very good person, but they were very many learning Jewish people who threw themselves behind Chef ice be He was quite a following of religious and non-religious claiming to be a messiah and he did some very unique things and it was actually surprising that he had so many followers. He was captured by a sultan. In captivity converted to Islam, right? And so this was a real Scandal you really should read this. It's it's quite humorous. Many of his followers. That wasn't even a big deal. For them that he converted to Islam. That was just like a bump in the road. They just kept going right along thinking he was, he was Messiah. It's actually not so different. Not so different from the way you view Messiah.

But anyways, once burned twice shy, so sheets, Rashi rambam. No one systemic work on the views of Messiah. Nobody did in the Jewish world. No, philosopher is a religious men in the Jewish World created Zuma of Jewish thought on the side. So therefore there is no consensus on what Messiah looks like, who will be how it will happen. We get Snippets here and we can Snippets there from history pass and forth from more modern, but there is no consensus. On this.

As I mentioned, a lot of what they have written on the topic has been in defense or has been written as an apologetic and a lot of land hardly at all.

there's, In the writings are a level of censorship self-censoring. Open messiah in their own. Writings, some, the censorship that happened to their writings because they lived in foreign lands and they couldn't write things exactly the way they wanted to end. So soon as we read the writings, it's you don't get the full picture and very few Jewish thinkers have been willing honestly Express. What do people have actually thought about Messiah? Because as soon as your do you start swerving in to Elaine that Christians have possessed for many years? Halacha, how you walk through big trunk. So it has undergone a metamorphosis more like an evolution and that's what I think we're going to look at today. So it is a very complex task. But you're all very smart people's and after all you did come to a lecture series on messing expectation. So if there are no longer words in the next section of my talk, I'm certainly handle it.

You're welcome. I believe in you.

Since there is no consensus. I do think it's helpful to look at larger concepts of his varied expectation.

Here's a quote from sholem who is a thinker.

Professor of Jewish mysticism at Hebrew University. He was an older contemporary of a doctor flu, sir. Philosopher historian and he wrote Judaism to. This is our first Grand category that we need to keep in mind in all its forms. And manifestations has always maintained a concept of redemption concept of Messiah as an event, which takes place publicly. On the stage of history and within the community.

It Is An Occurrence, which takes place in the visible world and cannot be conceived apart from such a visible parents. Are you starting to understand where this is going? In contrast, Christianity conceives of the Redemption as an event in spiritual. In the Unseen realm, an event, which is reflected in his soul in the private world of each individual. And which affects an inner transformation, which need not correspond to anything outside. And I would say, for the most part this does characterize, how many of us view our redemption in messiah messiah rains in my life, all the world supposed to do right now. It doesn't look like he's the king over all the world in the world.

Expecting something. No one would missed know. He was person with nist known person. Could misconstrue. They expect something very public.

What the, the follower of Yeshua. So as a deeper meaning,

Could you with person, seems like a attempt to be Trixie with how it should be?

The traditional Jewish mean is that the 16s Republic? In community, and it happens at the end of History. If you show, Christian view, is that an unseen? It's more private than inner transformation at the center of history. Now, maybe there's some sort of has overplayed his hand because I, I venture to say that most of the people in this room, not only think that this work is in you and he reigns in your life, but also that there will be a very public future coming of Messiah. Yes. Yes, maybe the other one wasn't public enough for a split. Of course. It was in a little city that really wasn't a very important and Roman Empire in the whole world.

It was a public saying that happened. I can understand the point here.

It's what goes on what appearance of Christian as a deeper apprehension of the external realm appear to the Jews. As it's very liquidation. You just move the goalposts Christian's Messiah is supposed to redeem. Redeem. The Jewish people's be king of Jewish people's. He's supposed to bring us through to the head and not the tail and Usher in a world that is for free of suffering and then send. But you just move the goalposts to this is all just inside. You. and it is seen as a flight which sought to escape verification with Innocent Ariel Ortiz, so,

Again, since there hasn't been a great consensus.

Some of the categories that you'll see or definitely, without a doubt represented in the process. They are, they are represented in the Psalms, but good luck trying to synthesize all these ideas because we know with already been reference today. There's two, there's not too much. Is there still coming of Messiah? And there's two ways in which was my come. There is no consensus on this in the Jewish world because of the passages, the scriptural passages. You can pick and choose some to a buttress, your point. The currents that you enjoy the current, that you find, good stream of thought that you liked has passages that can support it.

Here is another category that I think is helpful. Now, don't think of this in terms of Jewish and Christian traditional. We're leaving that one behind but I think you must remember, as you consider. It was friend, not getting this, passage that I give him as a group text.

India Agra get, it was a listing for Amazon either public.

How do you? This is more like the answering. The question. What type of Messiah do you expect? And there were these two streams of thought?

This is largely grounded in the prophetic. Writings. The prophets, little tax. Who look back. David. And say that's the ideal. David dobrik Kingdom will be strong even greater David. Plus. It's a very natural naturalistic thought. Put their begin to grow in the second temple. So it will take her test the middle. From these from this intertestamental literature.

More of a utopian idea that they only look back to David Messiah will be like David. This says, Messiah is David not to David +, David? David, greater than David. Significantly better than save it. Something really new.

Oh, he does is more Universal. This comes out a literature like Enoch or 4th Ezra parooze Testament of the 12 Patriarchs in AR test. AR test, the middle literature that was written between. Let's a 300 BC and 280. This is a revolution or metamorphosis inside of Jewish thought. Moving away from just restorative, now that the two bangs existed and they existed in, I think they existed.

Utopian is gaining interest during the second temple. And adherence. It looks for a future state that has really never existed in the past and it's a bit more Universal. Mel from this. A question Springs. As you consider, this utopian world will exist in the future with Messiah raining, and the lion and the lamb lying down together all this greatness. There's a question.

That may Russell within this. The coming of Messiah. Apocalyptic. Is it necessarily apocalyptic? You're just do what I say what I mean by the term apocalypse mean things. He did and didn't reveal hidden. But it also the way I'm using, it means like great catastrophes Wars revolutions, plagues of the utopian mindset, who saw a coming, that was very cataclysmic.

And I don't know how you think about it. But all throughout the question. Do you think I can come without?

Cataclysm, can you call without a part of our tradition to?

Never the last two were thinking in categories, just for a moment here. The utopian somewhat morph into an apocalyptic Viewpoint during the second temple. I was very much info, and I can say this with trauma-induced. Great upheaval during hasmonean. Time of great, upheaval during Harrods rain, because Rome is over top appeal of the time. So there's a lot of cultural upheaval and when that's the case, that's what you're living in. That's what the writings are trying to explain.

The idea that there's a wildness now that Messiah will come in the age to come and flatten it all out and it'll be good. So we have these two eons, the current world which gets very tremulous towards the end and then Messiah comes and then Messianic era piece. It's smooth, but I will remind you as we talked from this very spot. He flew, sir, and Doctor Natalie and others recognize that in the teachings of Yoshua. She doesn't seem to ascribe to this, to Siri. He seemed to have a needle point of redemption. It wasn't just this world in the age to come. There was something in between where salvation was still possible.

But in a sense, this apocalyptic, apocalyptic system was very much embraced by the early church. So we have it comes after great trauma. No, medieval Jewish exegesis, didn't like this. They didn't like the ideas of apokolips and World, upheaval. And they said about two kind of temperate and we'll use this term rationalistic coming of Messiah for how they viewed Messiah would come.

And it didn't start during the time of Kabbalah. But Kamala has influenced this very much. It is an incremental. Redemption. That. Messiah will come up. There are stages of redeeming that happened. Messiah comes when the world is ready for him like in a good state.

So that's why you getting this concept which is really a kabbalistic concept of tikkun Olam, repairing the world. My meritorious ask my goodies, innocence Messiah. Now he may have a date that set. It won't go past that, what they could come sooner. If we all engaged in study and love of neighbor and doing good, deeds. That is the rationalistic idea of the coming of Messiah. That was a birth. Of the medieval exegete, the rushing around, mama knows those type of people kind of Temperature in attempting to lessons the catastrophe of the world, bringing it more progressively and smoothly.

this I think, is a

To a question, which I will post to you. This is the question of what, what happens to the Torah? The instructions of God during this era when Messiah rains, whether it comes after great cataclysm. Or whether it comes progressively, what happens to the instruction that most of us in here? Love so deeply and care about what happens to Torah. Is it? Because

that actually, Was somewhat the way that Chef dies. He functioned in his moments of spiritual ecstasy. His followers mentioned that he would do things that were actually ants. I thought he saw it as okay, because when the site was here, It was a really nice from the Torah, depends on how you view God's instruction. It's you view, God's instruction is eternal as the only way for man to be then. Okay, you might see that, it's done away with me. If you see it as what's a guide rails for human interaction, with one another. So otherwise we're going to be doing all kind of types of heinous things to one another, therefore we needed before it was given to us. But what about in the Messianic era when you showed himself is raining. Do you still need? If we have it written in your heart on our hearts and in our hearts? Do we do we need The Specific Instructions Not to move. My neighbor's boundary marker because I wouldn't conceive of moving. My neighbor's boundary marker. You understand. I don't think it's a shallow question or an easy question to answer is very thought-provoking to me. But because of the people that are sitting in this room, I also think it creates a secondary problem. For some who believe that the tour is really done away with in the Messianic era and you think you're in the Messianic era? Here we go.

Followers of Yeshua can still see Christians being followers. Modern North American worldwide. Jesus father.

That the Hallmark of messiah in their lives is freedom, from Torah, Messiahs come. I don't have to do that law. I'm free from that. Freedom, because of Messiah. And that lawlessness is the very thing that a religious Jew would say is the reason we need Le Sia because of all the lawlessness going on in the world. We need besides us to come teach us how to do it. How to really follow God. Look at all this lawlessness. It's very puzzling because it's like how does the dog catches tail on this one?

I think it would necessitate a revolution and how many followers of Jesus talk about the Torah. I really do. Truthfully, even when they say they're free from the torrid most of most of our brothers and sisters. Don't just throw God's commands behind their back. They don't, they are incorporating them into their lives, really. It just the language that we used to talk about it. But this I think it's a very Interesting thought.

I leave this historical background now. The talk for a few brief minutes about some places where the Messiah is seen in the biblical text, but we're, let's say our fellows are Dutch, Brothers and Sisters Soul Messiah, that we may not have seen Messiah. We have our own scriptures. We like to point to, but those aren't always the same one where they noticed Messiah.

Where do we see? Rap song. Ya, Ben Abba said in the name from your Canon. All prophets prophesied only for the days of Messiah. This isn't a Babylonian talmud. There you go. Not a single one. That doesn't. All of the prophets. Where do you see him? All of the profits. And if you understand the, the idea that way, most of the religious Jewish people saw the profit, they were interpreters of the Torah. So it's more of the Books of Moses are there in the prophets. Their role was to interpret them for the people who were the first interpreters of Torah and all of them. Can we see in the storms? Commentaries is a cabalistic songs commentary, cold spoon of incense and there are seventy aspects to each and every verse. Good luck. Digging out. All the meanings of all the verses in truth. The aspects infinite. Is this generation? However, one of these aspects is revealed in our generation the aspect which the poor reveal concerns about my expectation, each and every verse of this commentary on the Psalms 10 be understood and explained in reference to Redemption my all the time.

I go back. No, I'm not.

Where do we see it in the very beginning?

Genesis Rob has a commentary on early Genesis. It says. Ruach Elohim in the spirit of God, hover fluttered. On the surface of the water. And a commentator says this spirit is the spirit of Messiah. Spirit of God is fluttering. As you read. Will you still get / your boss to go to another verse? The spirit of the Lord will rest on him? 11 to Find a passage in there. Let me know.

Isaiah, 11:2 the spirit of the Lord will rest on him, which is also an important passage the way we view Messiah.

Every verse of the Psalms and at the very beginning, where do you see Messiah? I want to build now into a few of my favorite secret names of more cryptic names of Messiah that you find in rabbinic literature. And one of those is the name. Light Messiah is light.

The word is Nella, and those of you who do Hebrew, I know his men in here are wondering why all remember that word. That's the Aramaic word from Daniel, 222 word for light.

Daniel 22 says t. Reveals deep and hidden things. He knows what is in darkness and dwells with him to help him. This is a Messianic reference light lives with God. Messiah lives with God.

Rabadaba of certain guy. I have no idea where that place has said the light dwells with him.

Let there be light. That's the third verse of Genesis, right? Means there was darkness in the world. Let the temple be rebuilt in Mathias days as it says in Isaiah 60. Arise Shine Your Light, your Messiah, your temple has come, the glory of the Lord has risen on you. These aren't really proof text in rabbinic. Literature literature has used. You can read one of these and then right next to it. Someone says, that's not the way it is at all. It's actually this way and then someone else says, that's not the way it is. Actually, that's why I miss someone else. That's not the way it is. Sometimes the rabbi said this and then someone says, well, I don't take it. That way. I can sense us, but usually not, but I find all of these fascinating. References, scripture references to light.

What are the cryptic names? Well-known, one of the better-known cryptic names of Messiah? Are we recall that our lord said this very thing about himself is she was supposed to been staying out of the world of Life? Another well-known. Cryptic name of Messiah is a shoot or a branch.

Read the whole show of the lady says, you know, what messiah's name is? His name is shoot or Branch. Not not.

Hit his name is shoot as it says, Behold a man whose name is shoot become. Zechariah 6:12. You love it, right? Shoot, this is Lamentations, Rabe. And here's the verse behold, the man whose name is Branch or shoot for he will shoot out or Branch out from his place and he will build the temple. I didn't know you could send. This is a Messianic reference, so too much my friend. They might say well. Your Messiah Kathy Messiah because there's really no temple built and we know that Messiah will rebuild the Temple, he will build the temple.

And we say what we will leave. This is Messianic also.

Show me that next coming.

We have we have our ways of reading the texts. We have things that makes sense to us, but I don't always make sense to our fellow and I don't think it's only their spiritual Darkness, prevents it. I do think it requires a spiritual Illuminating by the spirit of God to understand some of these things, but I don't think we can stretch of darkness in them. They expected something public that has bass. That's a baseline expectation for messiah. It would be a public thing that no one will miss. He will come people will flock to him, Israel be great again. There will be peace. He will reign is her will be the head, and not the tail. Messianic era a rebuilt Temple.

I don't discount. This is a name from the side branch. I like it. I believe it too. And I'm in my geology Place forced to put it in the next coming. One of the favorites, I think personal favorite. If not be personal favorite for me. What is the name of Messiah? Leprous one man who has leprosy, matura, anyone unfamiliar, who has it before your like scratching your head. Like you're telling me the rabbi said, his name is leper. Yeah, the rabbis have said, he's a leprous one. He has leprosy Babylonian 798 when he's very famous passages and she extended passage from folio like 96 2122, talking about the side. When will Messiah comes somebody asks, where will I find him since he's sitting room at the gates of Rome and he's sitting with those poor lepers, go ask him. It was really fun story of this guy going to ask him and what transpires because of that. But later, I'm not going to take the time to tell you the rabbi said, his name is leper scholar. He teaches the lepers and he himself has leprosy. And I think this is more than a hint that they recognize. That he would not be embraced widely by the people. I think this is more than a hint. But in his coming, he would not fully be embraced. And what is the proof tax for him being called leper or being a leper scholar is Isaiah 53. So anyone who tells you that the rabbis never interpreted Isaiah 53 as related to Messiah. It is either they don't know or they don't want to admit. They have historically it's in the writings of this is not a small bit of writing. This is a pound of the band. Queen founded. Here's a a text from Isaiah. He bore our griefs. He carried our sorrows yet. We esteemed him as a leper. Smitten by God Afflicted. This is the word not used to the word touched or struck. Which is the word used in Leviticus when talking about someone with Leprosy, that person has been touched or struck with Leprosy. Therefore. They read that One, Touch Fierce truck and they insert into here. We saw him as a leper. He is a leper.

A man from whom people turn their face. Not fully embraced.

I want it. Doug has already mentioned today, from Genesis 49. His name is Shiloh Shiloh. And this is their favorite name for messiah. Was she low? That's cool. She lost said, messiah's name is Sheila. Come on people. Everybody knows this as it says in Genesis 49:10, it's going to be this way until she do commas. The scepter will not depart from who to do the ruler star from between his feet to shelow or obedience or to whom it belongs, but they're taking it. Unto him shall Nations the obedience. The Nations will be obedient. Not just the Redemption. They're not just individuals. Not just of one nation but Nations, which is what we believe. How about Sun of parrots? I rather Like Son of parrots as a name for messiah parrots. Its first mentioned in Genesis 3829 as a child born to Tamar from Judah.

Because of the unique birth of the boys, the one came out. I seen a couple of birds. I don't totally get the story, but I'm sticking with it. The one came out, then, drew his hand, back in. And then his brother came out. And the Midwife said, how in the world. Did you manage to get out first? How do you break out? This boy, he deserves the name. Breakout. He's breaking something. He's creating us. A break. The bricks breaker. I think we still sounds a lot in his work messiah in light of the passengers or something like that. I really enjoy, and suggest you find what you're not really going to find. It doesn't know where the who has this book finish guy goes through how he does. And I believe this is he is a bridge breaker for the Hedge that has been created a locket lie around the Torah commands. Not not that he's breaking apart tour itself. But some of the protective Hedges that have been built through centuries around some of these commands, which really obscure the command. Felt as I said, most of them are well-intentioned commands. We do it to Grandma. We don't play cards with gambling and gambling associate with pool halls and billiards, because the association and he clears away. Some of this hedge that has been created around the law. I rather liked some of parrots. As the midrash continues is midrash from Exodus Rabon regarding parrots. In Ruth, 418. Here is the history of parrots. And it is a profound significance and God made all generations. And this is I think, or talk about the word Generations told. All generations, spelled effectively, but when parents are rose.

Paris the song Judith Paris a rose history began to be repaired.

Fully began to be fulfilled through him. Because from him, the Messiah would arise. Some of parrots than parrots is a secret name of Messiah and a mysterious day. God would cause death to be swallowed up at it says he will swallow up death forever. I'm in Ahmed.

Others, briefly the Lord, who bought a our righteousness from Jeremiah 23 63. Hold the days are coming, declares the Lord. When I will raise up for David. That you can interpret this as a restorative or a utopian. However, you want to take the path of a righteous Branch. Here. We got a twofer. We got to secret names, Branch King and deal wisely, and he shall execute Justice and righteousness in the land. And his Dave Yehuda will be saved. And yes, I will dwell securely. So are we in the Messianic era?

Does dwelling securely. You could understand how these passages can go and vote in both directions. They can be taken by by one who likes this stream of thought, over here. And this passage can be taken by another, who think of it stinks of a differently. Nevertheless. This is the name which will be called the Lord our righteousness.

That's a good one. How about comforter Menachem? His name is comforter because as it says, in lamentation these things, I weep my eyes flow is tears because the comforter is far away from me. Person commenting on this says, this is a reference to Messiah. Besides name is Menachem comforter. Want to revive my spirit. My children are desolate for the enemy. Has prevailed against them. But let's hope that the enemy is reconciled. Thank you Doug. I so much appreciated that insight into that Passage. How about Lebanon? Lebanon from Lavon? From Isaiah 10:34, he will cut the thickets of the forest with an axe and Lebanon will fall by The Majestic one, you could almost take this as a reference to the temple. But as Rob pointed out that I've pointed out, many years ago, Messiah is a representative of the nation. Therefore both of these are the same Lebanon as a reference to the temple because it makes the sense of the people white and Messiah does the same thing and he has a falling that happens. Another one of these, you know, which is the word that likely means. May he increase from Psalm 72? May his name endure forever. Like the sun. You known is his name. May people be blessed in him. All nations, call him blessed. Right. So I started off this section by say, where do we see him prophets? Psalms from the very beginning. And we had a smattering of unique names that were not very common to our way of thinking leper scholar and you known Menachem comforter. These are places where our fellows have seen references to Messiah and on and on, I can do this all afternoon presenting to you. My very favorites, cryptic names for messiah, that are seen in the midrash, but we have lunch.

And you would revolt.

If you remember, when I began. I made the statement that any discussion of Messianic expectation. However, it looks is really a discussion about Redemption. In what Manner will we be redeemed individuals and Nations?

How who? We all have these questions about Redemption.

How many most of us in this room? We believe that there's a personal Redemption that is a private thing that has happened in us and we live in messiah's. Goodness. We live in an age of Messiah. He reigns in our lives. We also believe he will drain differently in the future. We do expect something very public.

But whether you're asking the question, when will the Sia come? Or when will Messiah come again?

Whichever of those two questions, you're asking. There's a recognition that something is yet to be done. There's something unfulfilled something incomplete.

In our world, and in our lives. Unless you think your life is complete right now, which I I dare think I daresay you, don't you believe that there is some other Redemption that will happen.

And this. Is a recognition that we kind of live in a life. We live a life that's waiting in deferment. I use a quote from earlier and he also coined the term life in deferment. He said, the concept of messianism for a religious Jewish person is a very difficult concept because of the recognition That something is not finished. Something is not whole.

Best Kept hope. At worst, you have doubt. You have a feeling of powerlessness.

And I think many of us feel that way. We're so thankful. We're grateful. Our lives, are our lives are full. They're wonderful, but we still wait, we still wait for something else. We still waiting for a future Redemption. It's really not that much different from our fellows who are waiting for Redemption. Where is he? We need him. The world needs them. It's not a Jewish problem. It's a universal problem.

I want that completeness.

So,

there's a

Saying and sent Hedrick 98. I think it is blasted, be the bones of anyone who calculates the coming of Messiah.

Frank reference this a couple weeks ago. I think he used the term despair, the upon anyone who calculates the time. And you know, history is strewn with people who have made fools of themselves. Calculating the end calculating the coming of Messiah and I think one of the reasons this injunction from the rabbi is it really doesn't serve a lot of good. Because when the dates of past, then what are the people supposed to think about you? Personally, whether this thing is even going to happen at all.

So why don't you think you were hastening the coming of Messiah by meritorious Deeds like our Jewish brothers and sisters often do or what? I think? We're just going to hold on. Things are going to get a lot worse before they get better. I'm just going to hold brother and sister. It's going to get wild around here. It's going to be three people off. The sinking ship has made people out of burning buildings. We can hold on, going to get bad until Messiah comes and then he's going to set it. All right, whatever position you have. We wait. What weight?

and, I, in my waiting, I live my life. The way I believe, my Lord has asked me to live. I don't hunker down in the basement of my house. Just waiting. Will you come out to the street? And we live, we live waiting? because, I believe.

Perfect face or at least as much perfect Faith as I can muster. In the coming of Messiah. And even if he's slow and coming. I will wait for him.

Thank you.

Thank you. Alright, Kyle. Thank you very much. That's why I get this one. All right, but this here for just a moment.

Community conversation questions.

And then we have we're doing great on time. I commend first of all, personally I commend all three teachers provoking, lots of synergy working together for the good and respecting the time frame that you set up. So we're doing great and we have a special presentation and will conclude with the Lord's Prayer question question. So it's not a, just a question question. So you referenced Jeremiah 31 for this is a coven. I'll make with the house of Israel. After those days. I'll put my tour within them and write on their hearts and I'll be there. And they will be my people. The conclusion that passage with the rest of us is no longer will any of them teach his Community member or his brother know the Lord for all will know me and you ask a question. Where is the Torah in the Messianic era? And in that context is like okay. No one will have to teach you the Torah. Don't have to teach you how to know God cuz all will know him, but I'm wondering where you place a passage similar to that. And Isaiah 55 says storm-ravaged City. Unconsoled. I will set your stones in the finest way. Later foundations with sapphires, make your windows shine with rubies or gates with Garnet in your walls with gemstones. All your children will be taught by the Lord. Your children will have great peace in righteousness. You will be established far from oppression with nothing to fear. So is it that everyone will just know or is it that the Lord will teach our children? Or is, are they different? Are they in? Different, is are they in different time periods? Is it same the same thing or when do you place the Lord teaching our children? Is that is that the Messianic era? Now, the future when you know, just wondering your thoughts on that?

I don't know. He don't wants to be wise, must must teach his mouth to say, I don't know. I don't know, right. But you do highlight the nice. What I was trying to express that there are passages that they don't seem to a cord real well. So you can get ideas that are utopian and I restore or rationalistic an apocalyptic. You want to know my Endtime philosophy. I'll give it to. I really don't know anything about anything and I'm just going to keep living. I mean, I love the idea of the Lord teaching my children. So that they know. Then they'll know, I like that. Thank you for bringing those lovely passages up Ryan. Looks like you got something. okay, so two parts, one part is

I think what she was talking about. I think, well, children will be in New Jerusalem, right? With us. And God movies. I mean, I will be there with us in the middle. You will be the light and everything. He will be. All right. So it makes sense. I think he will be teaching the children. The children will be raised with the question is, do you know? Right? So I love the thought of Knowing, you know, in the Messianic era, just knowing what God wants and expects from you. I like that and then I also like the thought of children sitting at the feet of my Lord listening to him teach. So the whole thing about the public, we are the public as well cuz he says, we are the city that sits on the hill. So, I'll lives and I are. And if you want to call Redemption, I don't think it's pretend, I think us striving to be the people that God wants us to be the Messiah wants us to be, will allow people to see what work, how we're supposed to love and how we're supposed to carry our lives and that will be public. And in the second, It also says that he will, every I will see him in the coming from the clouds, can't get more public than that.

I was just out of gas. I just want to put that out there. I mean, that it will be very public and he said, it kind of traffic. I'm sorry. I can't. Thank you. Thank you.

Willoughby said, you said the candlemas desire come without that. Well, I don't think so. Cuz when he comes, he comes with his army, hunting was, these are kind of two historical ways that people have thought of his coming. And there were very learned way past you and I Jewish theologians and Bible man, who did, they were not eager for a apocalypse or anyting cataclysmic related to the coming of Messiah face. All it much more smooth. So they took their different passages because it's possible to do take certain passages and see it more as a, a Redemption that happens in stages. And our actions bring this. I'm not saying I agree with either of those. I was just laying them out there for bought, okay?

Let It Go here. Really magic lantern and I really like you pulling from the talmud in the writings because often and he break Messianic congregations. We say, do you see Jesus In this passage, where do you see Jesus In this passage? And sometimes that almost feels contrived but it's beautiful to see that. Yes, the rabbis are doing exactly the same thing. And then secondly, so the discussion about until Shiloh comes or until they bring tribute. How does that play out? And I was talking about both of my son here. This is for my son sit next to me and

What can you bring a tribute to God? Your son's.

This is how it plays out. Isaiah 66 does a part of helping of the things you were presenting. They're all true. These are just different views from it. Okay, is it cataclysmic? Yes, does the kingdom expenses world yet? They're all true. So it says my day last chapter of Isaiah and I'm going to skip a little bit more time for I know their works and their thoughts. The time is coming together. All the nation and Tonks and they shall come and see my glory. And I will set aside a month and I wonder if that's a leprous Mark. I got to, we got to check that among them and send survivors from them to the nation's and they will declare my glory among the nation's. Okay. And who's this is not just the juice. This is Israel. This is a broader context being spoken to about the Lost tribes and we could go even beyond that rat. So at what's the tribute that they bring, then they show bring all your brothers from all the nations as a grain offering to the Lord on horses and chariots and litters on mules and on camels to my holy mountain. Lion says the Lord. Just as the sons of Israel, bring their grain offering in a clean vessel to the house of the Lord for just as the new heavens and a new Earth, which I will make indoor before me to Claire's the Lord. So your Offspring and your name will endure that will be brought in to be bought by the nation's. No, greater treasure.